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I Am Unhappy About Download Counts

  • Thread starter thunderfoot
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thunderfoot

Deleted Due to Inactivity
Former MSFC Member
Kinda gonna rant here a little bit. Sorta upset. Starfox1701's Super Star Destroyer v2.0 has now been available here about two weeks. Been available over on A2Files nearly the same amount of time. D/L count here is 4. D/L count over there is about 92. Adjusting for disparity of membership sizes and extrapolating off this, the D/L count here at MSFC for this mod should be higher, should it not?

Going through the entire A2 portion of the Downloads section, it is uncommon to find D/L counts above 10 or 12. Why is this so? Is it worth the time and effort it takes to upload something here when a modder could just as easily send a YouSendIt retrieval code to the three or four people who are interested in something the modder's done? Could we not spare Majestic and the others whom contribute financially to the upkeep of this site the extra expense of DLC? That's right, people. The reason no adverts are popping up every five seconds and this site always loads smoothly in minimal time is Majestic and some others pay for this site out of their own pocket. If the Downloads Section is going to be used so little, why should they continue the extra expense?

I am not advocating a policy of, "I only get my D/Ls from MSFC" by any means. Some of the A2 DLC available at A2Files or AFC simply isn't available anywhere else. Nor is all of it ever going to be available anywhere else. Just as some of the things available here are exclusive as well. Exclusivity isn't always a bad thing as it allows a modder a little control over his work. But it surely would be nice for the MSFC Downloads Section to get a little more support from members registered here than it currently does. In a nutshell, I feel strongly MSFC should be a little more equal than it is.

A lot of modders (myself definitely included) are motivated by positive response to our public releases. When Sally Field said what she did at the Oscars, 'You like me. You really like me!', some of us can identify with this. Big surprise. Turns out TF has an ego the size of Alaska after all. Only on some things, people. Only on some things. What about someone who just got into modding A2, or any other game for that matter? How does this person feel about all that hard work when there is little or no response to the effort they've put into something? Yup. That's right, Mr. "Mod for Yourself First" just wrote what you just read. The newer people modding need a little positive feedback. The easiest way to provide this is to D/L here something they've released here.

Again, I'm not advocating a policy of "Download ONLY from MSFC". Nor am I suggesting Staff or Admins relax the controls in place on the Downloads Section. It works well the way it is currently set up. What I am unhappy about is it seems if something is available at a site other than MSFC as well as here then it gets D/L'd from the other site. Even if it was available here first.

Note: I like me some spirited discussion now and again. With strongly held opinions forcefully expressed being thrown back and forth like hand grenades with a very short fuse. As long as it doesn't fall into name calling, trolling, and all the other unpleasant things usually referred to as flame wars, then speak your mind and do so plainly. Just because I disagree with or dislike your opinion does not mean you do not deserve the courtesy of my attention and respect.
 

Terra_Inc

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Me agrees. I always try to encourage people to DL with my File Reviews. But that's all I can do (except for DLing, of course).

One of the reasons for the low download counts may be that MSFC is not a pure A2 site. We have many people here in the community, and some of them do not play or mod A2. Others have stopped to do so a while ago. And some just don't visit that often. But if you visit A2F, you do it because you want stuffs for your A2 install.

BTW, I'm always happy when I can upload something to the site. I think the same goes for Majestic. So keep sending in the good stuff, people!
 

Jetfreak

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True, it may all come down to simple preferences when it comes to the files themselves. There may be cases where some people may like a certain design, that's why it gets more downloads. While others may not be very popular at all, like odd ships or generic items and such.

Still, the generally low downloads for the files have also raised my concern as well. I can totally understand the feeling of being unappreciated for the effort. Takes a lot from ya' and sometimes is often a bummer. All that work, but pretty much meager results. :cry: On the other hand, It's also funny when the comments outnumber the number of downloads, I mean what the frick is that? :p LOL. But at least it is a sign of appreciation all the same.

Anyway, Is it lack of exposure perhaps? Is it laziness to try something new and unique? Is it personal issues or prejudice? I can't really say. But hey, it hasn't stop me from sending in stuff doesn't it? Majestic wanted to expand the line of available mods here and I'm just doing my part and all. Content is meant to be shared after all.
 
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Dan1025

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I've had the same thoughts TF.

As you say TF, there is a difference in membership sizes (plus people don't need to be members to download from A2F and other similar sites). Also, like Terra says, MSFC is not a pure A2 site.

I upload my stuff to as many places as possible to increase the chances that people who search the internet for A2 mods will come across it. People can download my stuff from wherever they like, as long as they do downlod it and enjoy it then I have no problems. That's one of the reasons I grant permission requests whenever I can, my stuff gets ported to FleetOps or even other games (Homeworld2 for example) so more people then get enjoyment from it.

Like you, I am also greatly motivated by the responses and reviews of the mods I create, it's one of the reasons why I create WIP threads on various forums when I'm working on something; hearing people say that they like what they've seen so far encourages me to keep releasing mods.

I've said this before - as long as someone out there is getting some fun and enjoyment from what I create then releasing it was worthwhile. I mod to improve the game and further my goal of making my personal install the way I want it to be, the fact that I can then pass that work on to others and see them enjoy it is a huge bonus. Not to mention the friends I've made and the people I've 'met' in this community, worth far more than the mods themselves IMO.

So yeah I can see where you're coming from, my Colonial Lightstar (my first MSFC exclusive content IIRC) has gotten like 11 downloads, but people still post comments to say they like it, and I enjoy using it in my own install, so it's OK.

I'll keep posting my stuff to multiple sites (credit issues willing), I'll keep modding as long as I derive some enjoyment from it, and I'll keep releasing my work as long as someone out there is downloading & enjoying it :)
 

Hellkite

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My thought on the matter is that this not just a game site in any since of the word.Yes we do mod things but that is not the Soul function of this site.

What the site is a community of like minded people, that enjoy Sci fi.
I for one would not have it any other way :thumbsup:
 
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thunderfoot

Deleted Due to Inactivity
Former MSFC Member
I agree HK, this is not solely a game site in any sense of the phrase. I too would not have it another way.

I'd like to see more than four to seven D/L's for something which I worked very hard on and spent a great deal of free time. Starfox spent about two months working up the original and it is impressive. I spent about two or three weeks tweaking the textures and getting the weapons to where they didn't all fire at once at the same target in one giant lethal rainbow. Hunting up an unused hardPoint from which to build and recover T.I.E. fighters, interceptors, and bombers also took some time. To have such an effort met with the underwhelming response it has recieved so far is very, very unmotivating. There is a ton of excellent work over in the Downloads Section which is ignored or under appreciated. Granted some of it has been around for a long time. Some of it is available elsewhere. Some of it has been ported over to other game formats.

It would be nice to see just a tiny bit more support from and activity by those of us whom do play games over in the Downloads Section here at MSFC.
 

Starfox1701

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Well I beleive that the overall A2 comunity is spread out of alot of cyberspace. I do wonder though. We have about 15-20 people that routinly post to A2 mod threads. That around 25% actually usng the mods
 

USS_Excalibur

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Well, to me... this community is a rather reserved one. And reserved communities with member-only downloads can restrict dwnld counts. Especially since not all of us got our 30 posts yet.
 

Knight

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Generally, I check here for what I want first... I prefer to download from MSFC wherever possible, if it fits in with one of my installs, particularly the ones I play most often.

That said, i do often take a look at whats available, and comment, even if I'm not downloading. The best example I can give of this is the Federation Outpost that Jet's uploaded. Its stunning, and it looks like a station rather than galaxy saucers stuck together with blocks. Its a nice improvement over the original station, and I feel that the hard work deserves some credit and recognition EVEN if I'm not going to be downloading it for use.

I'd love to use it, don't get me wrong, and I actually have the original version in my personal install. However, my version has additional hardpoints kindly added by Dan, to make it fit the use I had intended for it, and this is pretty much the only reason I'm sticking with the older version.
 

Terra_Inc

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Actually, the Download counts of the recent uploads could be 1 higher, but I'm too lazy... I just keep the copy I download from the mail. :oops: I am standing in the corner and being ashamed now.
 

Ryderstorm

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This site has a small membership base as compared to other sites namely A2 files. Also as stated before you have to be a member here and meet certain requirements before you can download files. With these 2 facts its not plausable to expect to see 100 downloads of a certain file or mod, at least not yet.

I myself have released one mod out of my entire modding career and that is hosted here exclusively. Last I checked it has 15 downloads. When I released it I felt like it was not up to the standard of quality as other mods available here but certain individuals here have convinced me otherwise and even one has been kind enough to make some improvements to it for me. I personally dont care if I have 15 or 1500 downloads. What matters to me is that at least one other person besides myself enjoyed my work. If I meet that goal then Im happy. And if 1500 people like and use my work thats just super but thats not my goal.

I can understand though when someone pours in tons of hours into creating something and then shares it and sees that they only got 4 downloads that their moral and ego get damaged. Its natural. But at the same time a lot of people have created some truly awesome stuff and kept it to themselves. I feel that if your happy enough about your work to share it then go ahead and share it. Thats how communities benefit is by sharing.
 

Borg_Queen

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Well, to me... this community is a rather reserved one. And reserved communities with member-only downloads can restrict dwnld counts. Especially since not all of us got our 30 posts yet.

That you need 30 posts (and 10 rep. points) to be able to download is a very recent feature, just about one week old. Before that, all you needed to be able to download was to post one post in the intro section and wait one hour.

In this thread: Community Input About Downloads - MSFC , you see talk about restrictions to the downloads. And the last post on page two is there this current restriction was mentioned as it was put in place.

So why people didn't chose to download that much even though they were able (everyone that had posted an intro post were able until about a week ago), is then a different matter than the 30 post restriction.
 
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Adm_Z

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Yeah, I too am highly motivated by downloads, and comments, but the question is: Would you rather have 4-7 honest people you know download your mod, vs 90 people you don't, who might rip you off in the process.

I honestly don't know. My first mod I did was a simple miranda class conversion which I released on both ff and fleetops. With combined downloads it got around 400 hits. I was quite proud, and this spurred me to make more and more. I eventually did a pack which got alot less downloads and I was quite surprised. Since then, I have not done anymore, but I have taken up this BSG project. I am faced with the issue that it will prally not even get more than 10 downloads from here, and I cannot release it anywhere else. I have been working on it for over a year now, and it might not only get 10 downloads? It is a shame, but I get PM's nerely every week with a new person asking for help, or telling me my old mods were good. If I can just help someone with their personal mod and get more praise(not to say that in an arrogant way.:sweat:) they why mod at all?

I think that until those PM's stop, or there is still just 10 people out there appreciating my work, then I will just keep pushing forward. I hope y'all do the same.


Oh, and just to let everyone know, I will be one of those 7-10 downloaders, so hopefully, 10 is enough to keep everyone else modding as well.:thumbsup:



I do think that new restrictions might cause there to be even less downloads though. I don't know if thats more harm than good, but at this point, I am not sure.
 
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thunderfoot

Deleted Due to Inactivity
Former MSFC Member
Well, I have at least succeeded at one of the things I set out to do when I started this thread. Namely. raise awareness of the Downloads Section here at MSFC. Before anyone gets the wrong idea it is all about the A2, I would also like to raise awareness there are mods for other games in there as well. Not many but they are there. If you have things which are not A2 or FleetOps based and you'd like to share them, then send them in ASAP.
 
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StarBlade

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For what it's worth, from "over there"....

MSFC's download section will never measure up to "over there" simply because it's not intended for that purpose. My interpretation of the 'Downloads' tab is that it's always been for Majestic to release his work and for the rest of us to contribute occasionally. And that tab comes second in line to "Forums" for a reason.

"Over there" is a different proposition. It's entirely, completely, exclusively and desperately devoted to mod content. All the other elements are simply add-ons. Forums are really only there to provide discussion about mods. Comments are intended to provide feedback about mods. Voting on mods is intended mostly to upset people (my opinion) by giving others the heartless and anonymous means by which to render their work a harsh judgement based on a simple, stupid numerical system. But that's the chosen setup because --you guessed it-- because it's moddin' uber alles.

There are other arguments thrown about for protecting mods by keeping them here instead of releasing them on a purpose-specific network "over there", ranging from heart to mod theft to comfort level among friends to whatever. I don't think any of them are particularly valid arguments, but ultimately we're all here --or there, or in both places-- as a matter of personal taste. I run the show "over there", and I like it there, but I still feel welcome here. They're not at cross purposes nor are they mutually exclusive. I like that a lot.

Ultimately, the origin determines the purpose. Majestic was uncomfortable having his mods "over there" so he made his own place and we all found our way here. Whether it was for Majestic's work or because of others' presence or maybe because "over there" isn't for you.... to each their own. And whether you want the private venue or the public venue (or both) to be the home for your mods, there's a choice to be made in the matter, and for the most part it's based on either prejudice or preference. But hey, vive la difference.

It just feels like the whole wealth of material that was once emergent and readily available for A2 is now a thing of the past. R5D5 recently released a wonderful new shipyard / station for the Federation-- in the past that thing would've had a hundred downloads in hours, especially on a weekend release. It's been up all weekend and (at present) 47 downloads have taken place. We're just not getting the numbers we used to, and whether that means anything remains to be seen.

But I want to make this clear: there is no competition between MSFC and "over there", at least not in my mind. I would welcome any new mod content "over there" but I also understand those who choose not to share. That's not an advertisement. It's how I've always felt. And I hope I always will.

:D
 

Majestic

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Thunderfoot, I am one that also comments but doesn't always download. First it was my space issue, I was almost maxed out. Now that I have about 3TB of space I find I only download what I am going to use. I don't download everything, as I don't have the space. I just do a full site backup instead every now and then in-case the hosts back-up harddrive dies or something, though they use several drives together so the likelihood is low this would happen.

I didn't download your mod as I am not a fan of large ships in A2, I don't like pathing problems, a reason I was never a fan of the Star Wars Fleet Command mod. Doesn't mean I can't appreciate it, just means it one of many that won't find a place in my install.

The sad truth of it is that people don't always download or comment of a file, look at the COE ships Jetfreak and I released. They have been downloaded what 2 time? One of them being me to test to see the download works correctly. While not the best out there I was hoping for a couple more, perhaps a total of 4 or 5 and a comment or two. But it never happened. Hasn't stopped me working on the full mod, just hasn't encouraged me to do as much as I was planning to.

But like Terra I often download from the mail, so Terra I'll join you in that corner. :lol:

Also to make a note, most of A2files downloaded stats are from lurkers, unregistered people etc. While we don't have that here, I still think we do rather well. Everyday I see someone looking at the download section, whether browsing or downloading. It isn't ignored or forgotten about, it's probably the biggest reason a new member comes here, that and the people who make up this community.

It just feels like the whole wealth of material that was once emergent and readily available for A2 is now a thing of the past. R5D5 recently released a wonderful new shipyard / station for the Federation-- in the past that thing would've had a hundred downloads in hours, especially on a weekend release. It's been up all weekend and (at present) 47 downloads have taken place. We're just not getting the numbers we used to, and whether that means anything remains to be seen.

But I want to make this clear: there is no competition between MSFC and "over there", at least not in my mind. I would welcome any new mod content "over there" but I also understand those who choose not to share. That's not an advertisement. It's how I've always felt. And I hope I always will.

:D

The entire community has flat lined recently, more than in the past. Look at the new uploads at A2Files, since the time my PC died till now there has been what 3 maybe four new uploads? It's not just MSFC feeling this, it's the entire A2 community. AFC is a ghost town, I think MSFC, A2Files and Fleet Ops are the most active atm, with the most new content being added.

I want to reinforce that we do not compete with A2files in anyway. I am a member over there as are many of our members here. If we wanted to compete wouldn't we have a no download restriction? It's in place to protect user created content and we also have a new idea in the works that may have everyone happy. I download from A2files as much as I do here.
 

Dominus_Noctis

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Just thought I'd pop on in this thread and say that while I do quite enjoy looking at the very nice screenshots and descriptions of the mods here (and elsewhere), I very rarely download mods. If I do, it's because I want to know how something works (particularly modding tutorials and tools at the moment), or because I'm helping someone out with balance/bugs/ideas stuff :) .

It's most definitely not that I don't appreciate the effort that has gone into the mods - I just prefer to look at them from afar and learn and help where I can. In fact, I wouldn't really know what to do with most mods if I were to download them. Sure I could take pictures, but that's what I'm seeing here. I guess I never have had any intrinsic desire to "make a collection" (or my own mod) either.
 
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StarBlade

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Look at the new uploads at A2Files, since the time my PC died till now there has been what 3 maybe four new uploads? It's not just MSFC feeling this, it's the entire A2 community. AFC is a ghost town, I think MSFC, A2Files and Fleet Ops are the most active atm, with the most new content being added.

I think we may, after ten years, be at the lowest point in terms of new content and active membership that we have ever been. The long, slow decline simply seems that much further along to those of us with long memories.

This subject --not the downloads, the decline-- is also the subject of a poll "over there" right now. While I'm pleasantly surprised by the relatively few votes for 'the admins SUCK', I'm watching the vote count just to see how many people are still out there and willing to vote. Chances are they'll download something, too.

:D
 

Undying_Nephalim

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I just have to say we as a community are lucky this community still exists. Armada is an old game and there are very few games that last this long. I am a bit disappointed and surprised at how quick everything seemed to decline last year though, as before the end of 2009 the A2 community seemed pretty active. :confused:

Generally I only download total conversions, as I rarely if ever play Armada with ships added in anymore. However I did download the SSD not long ago to check it out in MS3D (I am a fan of massive ships I suppose). For some reason though it crashed when I imported the SOD. :sweat:
 

Starfox1701

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Its the number of hardpoints. MS3D can handle maybe 250 joints. The SSD has more then 1100.
 

kjc733

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To be honest, in the past I've wondered if the d/l count actually works due to the low counts. I mean, I'm not massively active in the A2 community, and then I download something from here and am one of maybe half a dozen who has. I find it mildly surprisng, but not disturbing. People have their tastes. I'm sure the SSD is a lovely piece of work, but I'm not a star wars fan (and proud of it! :lol2: ). I'm also not a big fan of high poly models, so I don't download those either, and they're probably beautiful pieces of work too.

I do however always check here to see if what I want is here as well as "over there". If it is, then I download it here, and sometimes I find things that are better.

If you enjoy modding then mod. If you want to let others see it then upload it. I build meshes for personal enjoyment, people very rarely see them unless the build is by request in the first place. My (long and rambling) point is, don't get hung up on it.
 

miklosgo

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Hi. I'm Modding the A2 game and I like it. For some time, I'm modding FO. I'll be glad to download some of your stuff for A2 or FO, like space stations or ships, but right now, I can't access the MSFC's download section.
 
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