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Bird of prey: faster than lightspeed?

Aad Moerman

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It has been on my mind since I saw it for the very first time? How can it travel ftl? It has one type of propulsion and visible collectors. A pulsedrive can never reach ftl speed?
Am I overlooking something?
 

Majestic

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That has always been something I have thought about too. My only guess is if it has the warp coils incorporated into the impulse engine, you know one housing but 2 engines.
 

CABAL

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Frankly, the TOS Romulan BoP not having warp makes absolutely no sense. Since impulse doesn't seem to reach relativistic speeds, it would take millennia to reach the next system. According to the lore, they would have fought an entire war with Earth with ships more primitive than even that.

The only way it would make sense is if the BoP was meant to simply patrol the system it was built in. Build a few of them cheap at a colony so that they don't tie up the actual warp-capable warships with defense. Even that doesn't make sense, though, because the Romulans supposedly didn't have warp at all. Additionally, the Enterprise was at warp for a good chunk of the battle but didn't lose the BoP.

I just chalk it up to a scripting error. It was that writer's first episode and it was during the first season of the first show.
 

Majestic

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Frankly, the TOS Romulan BoP not having warp makes absolutely no sense. Since impulse doesn't seem to reach relativistic speeds, it would take millennia to reach the next system. According to the lore, they would have fought an entire war with Earth with ships more primitive than even that.

The only way it would make sense is if the BoP was meant to simply patrol the system it was built in. Build a few of them cheap at a colony so that they don't tie up the actual warp-capable warships with defense. Even that doesn't make sense, though, because the Romulans supposedly didn't have warp at all. Additionally, the Enterprise was at warp for a good chunk of the battle but didn't lose the BoP.

I just chalk it up to a scripting error. It was that writer's first episode and it was during the first season of the first show.

Yeah one of the biggest issues with Trek. I put it down to the Romulans having a different form of faster than light speed. Not as efficient as Federation/Klingon warp drives of the era but still an interstellar drive.

In fact I have adopted in my own YY timeline lore that the Romulans had less efficient reactors resulting in a lot that was seen in a Balance of Terror, as for the propulsion I like to think they had some form of advanced Impulse reactor that could reach warp speeds but had a time dialation effect a little like what was said in the Destiny Book with the Columbia. It wasn't until the Romulan/Klingon Alliance in the 2260's did they acquire better reactors and actual warp technology.
 

Aad Moerman

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I believe there is some misunderstanding. I had the klingon Bop in mind.
The Romulan Bop in the in TOS: "Balance of Terror" and the ships in Enterprise clearly have nacelles at the tip of their wings.
The Klingon Bop, on the other hand has these oversized disrupters.
Don't get me wrong, I love this design, it would really perfect when I didn't have this nagging thought: where are the warp engines?
I even contemplated to design a Bop with warpengines.
 

CABAL

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I believe there is some misunderstanding. I had the klingon Bop in mind.
The Romulan Bop in the in TOS: "Balance of Terror" and the ships in Enterprise clearly have nacelles at the tip of their wings.
The Klingon Bop, on the other hand has these oversized disrupters.
Don't get me wrong, I love this design, it would really perfect when I didn't have this nagging thought: where are the warp engines?
I even contemplated to design a Bop with warpengines.
Ohhhh. Sorry.:oops:

It must have some sort of internal drive. Memory Alpha says there's a single nacelle stuffed in the back. The source is flagged as (Star Trek III: The Search for Spock, etc.) so I'm not sure how accurate that is. What is included in etc.?

In real life, part of the reason for having the nacelles on long pylons away from the body was so that if they exploded they would cause less damage to the ship. Klingons probably don't care as much. They never were very interested in safety features.

A design with external nacelles would be nice. Maybe attached somewhere along the wings? An oversized warp drive would make it even better at hit and run attacks.
 

Hellkite

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bop wp.png

I always assumed that these were its warpdrive unites​
 

Aad Moerman

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Bop.jpg At that location on the image the nacelle would interfere with the pivot of the wings. See added image.
 

Majestic

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That has always been something I have thought about too. My only guess is if it has the warp coils incorporated into the impulse engine, you know one housing but 2 engines.

^ This is my guess on the Klingon BOP. It' the only thing that could possible make sense to me.
 

Jetfreak

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Well to be fair the 2150's BoP had some semblance of nacelles smacked on top of the hull.
latest
 

Hellkite

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I meant these bop warp.png

did not what to box in the impulse engine
 

kjc733

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According to my Haynes Owners Manual (don't worry, my main mode of transport is a Fiesta - it draws less attention) the bit pointed out by Hellkite is the Warp Wing Induction Energy Storage. From a quick glance, it seems that the BoP doesn't have a traditional set of Warp Coils, but instead uses the structure of the wing to shape the field (think capacitor). I'll copy out the propulsion section at some point.
 

Aad Moerman

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I can live with this, though this configuration differs significantly as seen on other klingon ships.
Thank you all for the input
 

CABAL

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I can live with this, though this configuration differs significantly as seen on other klingon ships.
Thank you all for the input
Well, it was originally supposed to be a Romulan built successor to the Original Series BoP so the designer may have designed it sans warp drive like an idiot.
 

kjc733

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The Bird of Prey achieves warp flight using a different system of energized alloys from other ships in the IKDF fleet. Most civilizations that are capable of faster than light travel use circular or oval rings of space-bending metals and composites. The familiar 'warp coils' - housed in stand off nacelles or incorporated within a starship hull - warp space and provide propulsion when they are exposed to high energy plasma.
Early Klingon, Vulcan, and Romulan vessels used this system to make their way through interstellar space, employing a variety of cryogenic fuels and antimatter to achieve greater and greater speeds and distances. While plasma reactions had originally been triggered directly within the nacelles, advances in pumping super hot plasma from remote - and protected - engines allowed for larger, more powerful systems. Magnetically line conduits could be routed through different structures. Crystalline materials such as ikemenite, faslonite, and dilithium became standards for regulating the furious energies and smoothing out the plasma frequencies within the core.
Design engineers within the Imperial Klingon Defense Forces, with ship commanders taking an active role in deciding what systems were to be installed in their ships, experimented early in the 22nd century with reshaping the usual nacelle configuration for new classes of fast, stealthy attack vessels.
It was determined that the sequential energizing of warp alloys did not necessarily require the 'coils' to be coils at all, but the alloys could be compacted into flat sheets. Beginning with Klingon vessels of the late 2120s, the energized warp wing was born, leading to the development of the B'rel-class Bird of Prey with its imposing bird shape.
In the B'rel class, plasma produced in the twin warp cores is allowed to fill and pressurize the central horizontal conduits that lead to the wings, through penetrations in the engineering hull on Deck 5. Each central conduit has a variable aperture duct, which works in concert with the wings to provide different amounts and pressures of plasma to the warp system depending on the flight mode - liftoff/landing, cruise, and attack.

More tomorrow... its complicated and my head is pounding.
 

dvatreknerd314

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I always thought it was the difference between the red and yellow bits of the rear engine thingy
 

Aad Moerman

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Thanks Nathanius.
From what manual is this?
 
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